I think the PFL really needs to look at reviewing the amateur status of the competition and seriously consider introducing a salary cap. No matter what system they have, there will always be clubs that try to work around it, but a cap would at least give smaller clubs a fighting chance to attract a few handy players they need to take the next step and move up the grades.
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Points system is a good tool for sure but impossible to enforce a salary cap with limited resources and hold all clubs to an equal measure. Just because its common knowledge doesn’t mean it’s possible to track.
More importantly clubs just need to be clear on what they can and can’t do financially and what their motivation is. Some clubs are really clear with it - win at all costs - pay as much as they can afford and hope for the best. Clubs that do this need to make sure they are sustainable.
Also when you have a cheque book you can end up with players that are not necessarily great for your club!!
Heard the clubs were asked this season if they wanted a salary cap introduced in a poorly worded questionnaire. Half the clubs wanted payments allowed and half didn’t want a salary cap. Unclear whether the half that didn’t want a salary cap didn’t want any payments allowed or didn’t want payment restricted by a salary cap…
What is clear is salary caps never work, whether that’s the PFLs $0 cap or the AFL clubs $18m, someone is going to go over it.
The PFL Player Points System is effective and a lot better than the WAFLs PPS.
Tigger said it right earlier, let people decide, if they want to open the cheque book for short term success at the risk of killing their club let them, and those that don’t can work other ways.
A lot of people i know that are involved in community football are there for that reason they love their mates. The clubs that can generate revenue through sponsorship and push that out the door on player can chase glory and the clubs that want to create tight knit community clubs can go down that path.
That will balance things out through the grades and it will be good to see who does what in my opinion
Yeah, let’s bring in player payments. Given the belief payments are common place, it means that clubs that don’t pay or have lesser means to pay are disadvantaged in
- less chance of winning
- Unable to recruit better players even those with past ties
- Harder to attract colts as they are following top level clubs or those that are winning
Those that want to go big, then make sure it’s sustainable, books professionally done, cover off on any potential tax, contract, payroll laws etc that comes with playing in a space that creeps not all that far from WAFL. Can clubs handle that level of scrutiny and legal requirements aswell as get volunteers who know a significant amount of others are getting paid.
Can the PFL handle it?
Don’t have an issue with some form of payment, but careful what you wish for.
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Some really good pionts raised in this discussion.
For my 5c worth after reading.
I believe a robust well governed and scrutinised PPS with no salary cap.
I think as at present the PPL would be unable to enforce the $$$ paid.
But the main thing is all Clubs are finally going to be on the same page.
As mentioned those that rely on cheque book had better be careful as it can be a slippery slope.
The clubs that work hard with sponsorship and generating revenue, hand in hand with junior club development and determined recruitment will reap the benefits.
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If player payments are as prevalent as everyone suggests then the disadvantages you have listed for clubs not paying already exist and have existed for a very long time possibly forever.
How many amateur football competitions exist?
The SA Ammos, now Adelaide Footy League introduced payments in 2016, current salary cap is approx $60k with max $650 a game for players.
The VAFA doesn’t allow payments but are allowed to cover player costs including medical expenses that the PFL doesn’t allow and footy friendly job offers regularly accompany player recruitment.
The absolute majority of competitions across Australia allow payments and have a player points system in place. All of these competitions have volunteers, have some players getting paid and others not being paid.
If other Leagues have navigated the change, the PFL will too. It might even be easier for clubs to manage instead of a third party being involved in player payments. I suspect club sponsorship would increase if payments were allowed.
Again if player payments are occurring then the PFL is already creeping into the WAFL space but so are the extremely well paying Country Leagues such as Kalgoorlie and South West FL. If the PFL introduced payments then you are more likely to see less ex-WAFL players travelling and staying local. The WAFL also needs to increase its salary cap significantly, it hasn’t kept up with inflation over the last 30 years - its needs to increase another $100k+
The PFL has stuck its head in the sand for decades about player payments, penalising a couple of clubs for minor infractions with serious penalties and even de-registered a player for not signing a stat dec to say he wasn’t getting paid yet the club he represented went unpunished…how does that work?
It’s time for the PFL to acknowledge significant player payments exist across most League grades and recognise that players have ‘value’ and will be compensated, allowing the Player Points System to control spread of talent across clubs and competitions.
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We’ve been banging on at the Commission for years to raise it and on the odd occasion it is,it barely seems enough.
Almost seems like that’s a deliberate policy to keep the breaks on and forever dragging,like Big Boy in Easy Money.
Without shifting too far away from the PFL discussion, the WAFC have failed to run footy in WA well for far too long. Too many internal pats on the back for a job well done based on questionable participation levels, more jobs created and bigger salaries for average outcomes is the way at the WAFC. The WAFL clubs haven’t helped themselves either happy to accept minor increases in annual WAFC payments to allow WCER and Freo/Peel alignment to tear away at the history and integrity of the WAFL competition.
The WAFC might as well be a government department how inefficiently it is run and how much money they waste.
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Perhaps if the Clubs surveyed their Members on such matters,their approach to things with the Football Commission would be different.
I’ll let you move on here with PFL Matters,…..
You should see what they’ve done to the junior comp this season!
Colts?
Youth and mods.
The clubs who voted no will be the clubs that can’t afford to pay. If a club in a lower grade can afford to pay its generally for a season or 2 then the money dries up and the players leave.
It is not a viable option for most C grade clubs and they will never get up the rungs.
VIPER,
Just because you can pay…does not mean you do pay.
However at least all clubs have the same opportunities and are on the same page.
As it is quite a few of the higher grade clubs are thumbing their nose at the rules and getting away with it.
They have well established 3rd party payment systems and ‘useful’ legal contacts with healthy budgets.
If a lower grade club feel a certain player would add value to the side/club they should be able to have a crack at getting him rather than said player going to a higher grade club that will pay anyway.
Clubs have been paying for years Chris. Decades in fact.
The same page issue I’m not Sure I follow.
You still can’t trace brown paper bags - the point is more whether your club is on the same page - where do you want be heading? What kind of environment do you want? If you want to be an A grade or B grade club at the top end - history says you need to bring in some talent who are hopefully good fit and who you can sling some dollars too - not life changing money but enough to have a holiday with the girlfriend.
The move up from the lower C Grades is a long process and it’s not just about whether a club has money to spend.
All of the consistent A Grade clubs have 4 (or more) senior sides and most have 2 colts sides. They have depth.
Clubs with only 2 Senior and a colts side will always struggle in A & B grade.
the problem becomes if you don’t pay you fall down further as the teams that pay up end up rising.
Paying players introduces other issues. Only have to look at Salariaco if you want to see what happens when one club has more payments than other clubs.
Do you split into two competitions?
PAFA = Perth Ammos Football Association (Unpaid)
PFL = Perth Football League (Paid)
Highly unlikely i know but just something to consider.
But if it’s not viable for most C Grade clubs then how will most C grade clubs be affected?
Early you said that there is clubs in C5 currently paying players, so how many clubs are paying?
Yeah Subi had a good deal and plenty of cash but I think it’s important to recognise that they also had a very consistent staff off-field, Schofield was a great coach and they built a culture of success. Under Wardman that fell away significantly.
At PFL level, North Beach under Duckworth, University under Luke Dwyer, Curtin with Craig White all the same - strong on and off field and depth of players across 4+ senior grades and 2 colts.
Whilst the notion that every club can reach B & A Grade with the promotion/relegation system, the reality is that most grades haven’t changed significantly for several years with clubs generally finding their own level and staying there. They might have a few years up or down a grade but they generally float at the same level.
Think about any PFL club and you’ll say they are an A B C1 etc club. Theres not too many clubs I can think of that have climbed 2 or 3 grades and stuck in that grade for a significant period of time, nor has there been too many clubs that have fallen 2 or 3 grades and stayed there. And for the clubs which have theres usually a pretty easy explanation - change in coaches or executive committee or both.